FAQ: Wheels within Wheels and Fate vs. Destiny

By Wes Penre, Feb. 25, 2020

Wheels of Time

In our video section, we have a video termed, “wheels within wheels,” which is an old, esoteric term, used in secret societies and built on occult knowledge the Elite possesses. We could also call it “wheels of time.”

One way of looking at this concept is that time is not really linear in this 3-D Matrix; it’s cyclic, just like a wheel. Our 3-D time, which we perceive as linear, is constantly repeating itself. In a few videos, we have discussed that apparently we humans, instead of reincarnating randomly in different locations from lifetime to lifetime, we repeat the same life over and over with amnesia, until we “get it right,” from the Overlords’ perspective. This is also where the concept of karma is brought into the picture; we are told in the Between Lives Area (BLA) that we need to go back to Earth and work on our karma before we can stop reincarnating.

When souls reincarnate, they do so with a blank slate; they have no memories of past lives. Therefore, the evolutionary tasks we have accomplished in the previous life have been memory wiped. We have explained how this is done in videos discussing the splitting of souls in the BLA (browse our video section for titles on soul splitting). Thus, we literally need to start from scratch every lifetime, trying to make “better” decisions this time around. Although, with no memories of earlier “mistakes,” it’s most likely that we make similar choices lifetime after lifetime, until we slowly learn; very slowly!

What does the word “reCYCLE” mean? Cycle is a process that is completed (such as a lifetime), and the prefix “re” of course means “over again/repeat.” Thus, we have the definition, “completed and repeated all over again.” This can be compared to a wheel upon which we humans travel continuously; we are repeating the same wheel almost endlessly, like an ant walking around and around on the brim of a circled surface, such as a lid, thinking it is moving forward when it’s moving in circles.

Now, we have a picture of the wheel the human soul is stuck in here in 3-D, repeating the same lifetime over and over. Although each lifetime is basically the same, including the same characters, we have very limited freewill to make other choices, compared to the previous incarnation cycle, but when we make a different choice here and there, the “game” changes a little bit–we start a new timeline. If we make new choices that benefit us in our 3-D experience or beyond, we are said to make progress, and if we make decisions leading to more hardship, we are said to make bad choices. This is how evolution is graded in the Matrix, while we are running around blindfolded, with no previous reference point, i.e. we have amnesia.

What we’ve discussed thus far is our personal wheel of time, but as this article indicates, there are wheels within wheels, i.e. there are also bigger cycles. We humans are greatly affected by astrology and how the heavenly bodies–particularly within the firmament–are moving across the sky. If we, as we suggest, are always born into the same life, repeatedly, we are also born at the same time of the year each lifetime, when the astrological celestial bodies are positioned in a certain way. This means that certain energies are present in our birth chart, and the astrological alignments are affecting us throughout our lifetime. This is also why good astrologers can “predict” our future.

We are also affected by greater cycles, such as the rotation of the Milky Way galaxy, of which we are part. An example of this is the nano-second that was discussed in detail in the Wes Penre Papers (WPP). Between 1987-2012, we were getting in alignment with the Galactic Center, and powerful energies were hitting our construct, which made many people start waking up, spiritually.

The planet Saturn (our original sun) is widely known as the “Time Keeper,” and this is literally so. We can visualize it as if Saturn was a big clock, wound up and set to a certain time before the alarm goes off. We would suggest that, at least in this construct, there are many different alarms being set. It seems as if one alarm is set to 2,156 years, and after that, there is a reset, where after a paradigm shift occurs. Thus, we have the era of Aries, Pisces, and Aquarius, for instance. This is also cyclic; one big cycle is completed when we’ve gone through all the twelve astrological signs of the Zodiac. Also, each time we go into a new Zodiacal cycle, usually a new “god” is taking charge over the new astrological Era.

When the Tiamaat Construct was created, we are quite confident that the Queen and Her Helpers used a Time Keeper, as well, whether it was through Saturn or some other celestial body (there are indications that in our solar system, Saturn has always been the Time Keeper). Most likely, the Queen set an end point for the original Experiment; let’s say one million years; and when the hourglass was empty, the Experiment would be over, and we would all return to Orion as graduated souls, or not. An evaluation would probably have been done, once the Experiment was over. If we graduated before the time was up, so much better, we would presume.

However, we know that we never got the chance to reach a point of graduation on Tiamaat, so the Experiment continued on Earth, until the Deluge was supposed to end the Experiment. It didn’t! En.ki and the Invader Force hijacked the Experiment, and it’s in this hijacked construct we are currently operating. Marduk, having taken control over Saturn, has adjusted the clock–probably on several occasions–so the Overlords can gain time, keeping us stuck in a continuous time-loop.

Now, let’s see how fate and destiny fit into this picture:

Fate versus Destiny

Before we move on, let’s look at the difference between fate and destiny:

Fate is that which you cannot change. Destiny is that which you’re meant to do. While fate is what happens when you don’t take responsibility for your life, destiny is what happens when you commit to growing, learning, and taking chances. Being “destined for greatness” only comes through active and conscious decisions. [Quora.com]

As this definition teaches us, fate is something we can’t change or refuse to change, while destiny is when we are heading toward a certain goal–known or unbeknownst to us. In the WPP, a section was dedicated to the Tablets of Destiny, which outlined the destiny for the human soul group from Orion’s perspective, i.e. the goal of the Experiment was outlined in these tablets, with loose directions how we were going to get there. These tablets–or most of them–were stolen by the Overlords but later taken back by Prince Ninurta.

So, the goal of the Experiment is our destiny, and if we follow the path leading toward that goal, we are meeting our destiny. While doing so, we were meant to use our freewill, with no strings attached, to see if we could elevate ourselves to a point where we could increase our love, compassion, and empathy while operating in a relatively harsh environment.

Therefore, from an overall perspective, our existence is not built on fate but on destiny. However, there are segments of fate embedded in our current Construct, as well, compared to the Original Experiment (Tiamaat), where fate was not a part of the equation. One example of fate in the Matrix is death. Here, death is inevitable for everybody; therefore, the word fate is applicable in that situation. Mind you that birth is not fate because not all souls within the Construct is incarnating. Souls eventually “graduate” from the Earth plane and become spirit guides and Ascended Masters, etc. However, “evolved” humans are still trapped within the Matrix System.

We hope this FAQ has been helpful!


  1. Hi
    A while back I was working in a place in England called southwold, this area was where Anglo Saxons once lived. I for no apparent reason decided to drive back home some 100 miles away by driving well out of my way. Something told me to do it.
    As I was driving home something came over me, one of a feeling of knowing, recognising the area I was driving through, not from features but from feeling. Suddenly there it was a village called Berge Apton. I drove through this place again and again prolonging my journey looking for a visual recognition. I found none.
    I decided to continue my journey home.
    My feeling of recognition would not leave me over the next few days, it kept calling me over and over again, no words just feelings.
    I looked at some old maps of Berge Apton and it hit me, there on the map showed an old Anglo Saxon burial site, in poor soil and hurried circumstances.
    The overwhelming feeling of death hit me, death and abandonment.
    Once I had felt this all past troubles had left me.
    It has bought back many memories, all very vague.
    But old English feels like a language that I recognise, it seems as though it could evoke spells of old.

    Over the wheels of time, it seems to me they overlay each other, of course this is because as Wes has said that time is not linear but simultaneous. I totally agree. We live in this cycle and in that cycle our separate soul splinters live in different spikes of the wheel, all at the same time or cycle.

    It seems to me this is what holds us here, time here is an illusion, backed by physical experience. It matters not that each time we enter this realm our experience can change, as our defined self here on this earth, an infinite amount of times. Each time we share this experience so our storey changes together. To our overlords they have created this concept, we reinforce it with our loosh.
    Our loosh could be a resonant frequency that we have in an endless quantity. We emit it and our overlords consume it. It is virtually impossible to pay attention to our loosh as it is part of us like the core of a tree.
    Perhaps we must accept this, with no regret and when we die there is nothing here to hold us, we leave through the grid without a glimpse back, without a thought. We concentrate on our creative core and build upon that. There is no fight apart from the one within, it manifests itself in many ways on the outside, in this realm.

    I’m sure there is a storey within a storey in these wheels of time. I find a sense of peace in this, inner turmoil seems to hold us here, perhaps if we can let go of this then inner calm will prevail.

    It does seem as though we suffer here, we do, but it is of no consequence if your intent is to leave this realm and it’s endless wheels and cycles.

    With love
    For your research

      1. Hi
        I must admit I wrote the above comment without reading your article first. I have read it now though.
        You say Saturn is the time keeper for this construct. I only know this because you have said it. We have been told many times what this solar system looks like from a 3D perspective, in fact we have been told many things about our existence here.
        Of course in our many lifetimes these change from one perspective to another.
        I once read that a great North American chief was introduced to the concept of Christianity, how heaven receives you upon death and the concept of the devil and mortal sin. This of course to him was a completely new concept. When the priest asked him did he not know of these things the chief replied no of course not, and asked why on Earth this priest had told him. I wonder how this chiefs fate and destiny was shaped by this conversation and how the influential priest fate and destiny was shaped to lead him on his path.
        I have read Robert Monroes Journeys out of the body. I have not read the exercises on how to perform what he did.
        It seems that we are all heavily influenced by our actions here by each other, our creative thoughts seem to coalesce and become real, here there and everywhere within this construct upon construct upon construct.
        We seem seem to be held here through our thoughts and actions, all of which constantly change by our interaction with others. This can be partly controlled by the overlords by supplying us with certain knowledge with the hope that we tread the path upon which they want us to lead.
        But as you say Wes we are very unpredictable, even when our true selves are asleep here, our creative juices must sometimes drive them mad. Although we seem to be good lulus at this point on the cycle of time, all slowly condensing our thoughts into a single way of thinking.
        I have an exercise that can take your weary mind away from this construct. It is one of my own so don’t bother if you don’t want to.
        Here it is.
        Go outside to a quite wood or forest, it doesn’t matter if it’s windy. Take hold of a tree by touching it with your hands.
        Say hello and pass on your good intentions.
        Close your eyes and think of its roots.
        Think of the soil around it.
        Think of the water that flows through it.
        Think of the trillions of bacteria that interchange with it.
        Follow all this through it’s roots, it’s trunk it’s foliage and into the ether.
        Away from this construct
        And into the stars.

        I think that is where I belong, not here.


        1. Your exercise seems to be a good one, IMO. It is both grounding and expanding at the same time! Could be worth trying for those who read these comments. Thanks for sharing, Andy!

  2. I really liked reading this article…..it makes one wonder …..how many times have I lived this particular timeline?……..I woke up in 2013…..because of your information wes….it all started with your papers…..then I read bringers of the dawn and spent many nights studying and reading that book…..there is an exercise in chapter 21or 22 of that book that says to spin around in circle while looking at your thumb 99 times in a day….when I did this exercise I started seeing all kinds of numbers such as 11:11 or 4:44 or 811….
    I also was outside a lot during the summers of 2012 and 2013…..so I got a lot of energy during the end of the nano second…….I like your research because you always have soulutions…!!

  3. Wes, your paper hit the nail for me…connected the dots that I have been trying to do myself. So much clarity after reading all your books and papers and watched all your videos on youtube. Just want to say, thank you. There are two important days in life, one is when you were born, and another is the day you find out why.

  4. “When souls reincarnate, they do so with a blank slate; they have no memories of past lives.” – The following examples show that (1) All of us reincarnate (2) We have memory at birth (3) Our memory is in the universe (4) we are guided by destiny from birth to death, moment by moment.

    A baby boy was born in a hospital with birthmarks of a bullet wounds on his chest and back. Doctors, nurses, and parents confirmed the observation. When the boy learned to speak around the age of two, then over a period of time he talked about his past life, which can be summarized in the following way.

    The boy’s name was N in previous life. He died in hospital H of town T on date D, due to a gunshot wound on his chest. Over time, the research scholars, news reporters, parents visited the hospital H and verified everything that the boy had said from the autopsy records of the man named N, who indeed died on the date D.

    On another such a case the boy had complications, and the doctors had to perform surgery on the boy to save him. The doctors found the complete straight line bullet path inside the body of the baby, exactly matching the autopsy record of the dead body of the boy’s previous life.

    The above two examples show that the following are true. (a) The babies are not naturally grown inside the mother‘s womb. The soul of the baby manufactures the human body according to its own destiny. (b) Since during the growth period, there was no brain for the baby, all intelligences and effects came from the memory of the universe and retrieved by the soul of the baby, which is the creator of the baby. Take a look at https://www.academia.edu/38590496/A_COMPARISON_OF_MODERN_SCIENCE_WITH_VEDIC_SCIENCE

    1. Sure, this ^ happen, but it’s extremely rare, of course. Why is it happening? Well, we know we’re manipulated, so why wouldn’t the Overlord be able to “insert” certain things into the Construct if it somehow fits their purpose?

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